Generally, I've found that people who are interested in the H?W pairing (sexual or otherwise) who have problems with Wilson don't hate him. Those tend to be, and I generalize, Huddy and Hameron fans who piss me off with their opinions of Wilson, usually because they are so shallow!
I don't have a lot of experience with Hameron shippers, but Huddy shippers (and I just KNOW I'm going to catch hell for saying this) make me crazy. I really didn't mind Huddy shippers until I realized that as a group they are just so out there. They are delusional and so obsessed that they can't even recognize reality any more. Certainly not all of them, but there are a LOT of them. Shallow? Yes, in the way that they can't see or tolerate anything besides Huddy. (Believe it or not, I actually ship House/Wilson. I'm sure some of the people I've been chatting with would be surprised to hear that, but I've always been into slash.)
I'm torn as to whether Wilson truly doesn't understand the effect he has on House, or if on some level he DOES understand, but is just to exhausted and worn-out to acknowledge and then deal with it. I do believe that when House hurts Wilson (which hasn't REALLy happened since season 3, JMO) he knows exactly what he is doing. Which is worse? I don't know.
I can't think of a time when I thought, "Gee, Wilson realizes that he's hurting House." Usually I'm yelling at him to stop before he sends the guy over the edge. When House hurts Wilson (and you're right, it hasn't been much at all lately), you know he knows he's doing it. I know I'm biased, but I think it's worse when you DON'T know your doing it because you'd have no reference point to measure against when deciding just how far to go. When House deliberately sets out to hurt Wilson, he can gauge Wilson's reaction and he can control the outcome because he knows what kind of effect he's having. Wilson is a bit more dangerous because he's clueless as to the damage he is doing. He doesn't know when to stop because he doesn't really have a way to judge what that point should be.
Depression and medication ARE things I have dealt with personally, so the way Wilson deals with his depression helps me connect with him. I also have a need to feel needed, in that I like to take care of people. Also, I am not an insecure person, but I do feel safer and more secure in my relationships if I am providing some sort of caretaking, emotional or otherwise. I also have a compulsive need to appear well-adjusted and healthy, which I am slowly but surely shaking off in therapy (next step- blue hair!).
I can certainly see why you would relate to him. You sound very much like him! Good for you for recognizing and getting help, though. I have suffered with depression for most of my life (I'm WAY older than you, btw!) and I can understand what you have gone through.
I do believe House is a tragic character, but it frustrated me, for example, that he couldn't just tell Wilson, Yes, yes I am in therapy, now FUCK OFF. I understand why he didn't, but I really wish he would.
I wish he would, too! Just once I'd like to see him just tell him off and walk away. Sadly, he never will because he needs Wilson. He carries guilt because of Amber, and I really think House believes he owes Wilson more than he can ever give. It's sad to see what abuse the man will take from both Wilson and Cuddy. It's sadder to think that he believes he deserves it.
No worries, the Huddy shippers are crazy. i was reading comments from a recent spoiler (baaaad idea) and there were a bunch of reasonable anti-Huddy posts, and then out of nowhere: "Oh, shut up, you crazy, bitter Hamerons. Huddy 4eva!!" And I was lie, WTF? Nobody mentioned Hameron/Cameron. (And, god, do I hate shipper names.)
On the one hand, I do think Wilson is dangerous in that he doesn't know when House is in a bad place, where pushing could have serious negative results. On the other hand, House knows exactly HOW to push when he wants to hurt Wilson. I'm not sure that he ever would, but if he wanted to House is entirely capable of hurting Wilson deeply at a bad moment. I think we see this side of House most when he's being mean to Cuddy, which is another reason I can't get behind the pairing.
In terms of depression, I got lucky enough to make two incredibly friends who helped me SO much. I met them when I was 14, and this guy was 17, and he could be doing anything at all, and if I showed up and needed to talk, he would drop anything. The other friend had swallowed a bottle of aspirin a year before, and she was the one who helped me ask my parents for therapy. There were a few other guys who were kind-of big brothers to me, and they all took such good care of me. Not related to H/W at all, so moving on...
I've been thinking about what you can owe someone without some sort of implied consent on you part. The only thing I can think of is money. What House thinks he owes Wilson is crap, because he didn't really agree to be in a place to owe them. Does that make sense? And for Wilson, I don't think he WANTS House to owe him, exactly, but I do think Wilson is so tired and run-down that he doesn't have it in him to fix his relationship with House, and having House feel he owes Wilson makes Wilson's life easier. Did that make sense?
No worries, the Huddy shippers are crazy. i was reading comments from a recent spoiler (baaaad idea) and there were a bunch of reasonable anti-Huddy posts, and then out of nowhere: "Oh, shut up, you crazy, bitter Hamerons. Huddy 4eva!!" And I was lie, WTF? Nobody mentioned Hameron/Cameron. (And, god, do I hate shipper names.)
What bugs me more than anything is that there could be a discussion following (say, for example, a spoiler) where not only is Cuddy not in it, but there is nothing to even suggest that she even exists and the Huddy shippers will inevitably jump in with "OMG Huddy sex!!". There's nothing more intolerable for me than when a nice, intelligent discussion is totally ruined by a comment that is completely irrelevant and uncalled for. The other thing is that the Huddy shippers are the first to call everyone else bitter. (I'm not saying other shippers are not guilty, but the Huddy shippers are certainly the loudest and most outspoken, IMHO.)
On the one hand, I do think Wilson is dangerous in that he doesn't know when House is in a bad place, where pushing could have serious negative results. On the other hand, House knows exactly HOW to push when he wants to hurt Wilson. I'm not sure that he ever would, but if he wanted to House is entirely capable of hurting Wilson deeply at a bad moment. I think we see this side of House most when he's being mean to Cuddy, which is another reason I can't get behind the pairing.
I absolutely agree. There was never a doubt that House was capable of hurting people. I just watched "Finding Judas" last night and I think it is a good example of how House can intentionally hurt someone if he wants to. House can be hurtful to anyone at anytime. It's one of his character' main traits and it's perfectly balanced by the amount of good he does by saving patients when no one else can.
I've been thinking about what you can owe someone without some sort of implied consent on you part. The only thing I can think of is money. What House thinks he owes Wilson is crap, because he didn't really agree to be in a place to owe them. Does that make sense?
I'm not too sure I understand what you mean here. Remove Wilson from the equation and put in the scenario from "Words and Deeds" where Cuddy lied on the witness stand to keep House from going to jail. How do you see this as an example of what you are trying to say? I'm guessing that in this example what you would be saying is that House doesn't owe Cuddy a thing because he never asked her to perjure herself on his behalf. She holds it over his head for a long time afterwards, but it was her choice to do what she did and she shouldn't use it against House. Is this what you are saying?
And for Wilson, I don't think he WANTS House to owe him, exactly, but I do think Wilson is so tired and run-down that he doesn't have it in him to fix his relationship with House, and having House feel he owes Wilson makes Wilson's life easier. Did that make sense?
This makes sense, yes.
In terms of depression, I got lucky enough to make two incredibly friends who helped me SO much.
![[profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
californiaquail : comments.
(no subject)
I don't have a lot of experience with Hameron shippers, but Huddy shippers (and I just KNOW I'm going to catch hell for saying this) make me crazy. I really didn't mind Huddy shippers until I realized that as a group they are just so out there. They are delusional and so obsessed that they can't even recognize reality any more. Certainly not all of them, but there are a LOT of them. Shallow? Yes, in the way that they can't see or tolerate anything besides Huddy. (Believe it or not, I actually ship House/Wilson. I'm sure some of the people I've been chatting with would be surprised to hear that, but I've always been into slash.)
I'm torn as to whether Wilson truly doesn't understand the effect he has on House, or if on some level he DOES understand, but is just to exhausted and worn-out to acknowledge and then deal with it. I do believe that when House hurts Wilson (which hasn't REALLy happened since season 3, JMO) he knows exactly what he is doing. Which is worse? I don't know.
I can't think of a time when I thought, "Gee, Wilson realizes that he's hurting House." Usually I'm yelling at him to stop before he sends the guy over the edge. When House hurts Wilson (and you're right, it hasn't been much at all lately), you know he knows he's doing it. I know I'm biased, but I think it's worse when you DON'T know your doing it because you'd have no reference point to measure against when deciding just how far to go.
When House deliberately sets out to hurt Wilson, he can gauge Wilson's reaction and he can control the outcome because he knows what kind of effect he's having. Wilson is a bit more dangerous because he's clueless as to the damage he is doing. He doesn't know when to stop because he doesn't really have a way to judge what that point should be.
Depression and medication ARE things I have dealt with personally, so the way Wilson deals with his depression helps me connect with him. I also have a need to feel needed, in that I like to take care of people. Also, I am not an insecure person, but I do feel safer and more secure in my relationships if I am providing some sort of caretaking, emotional or otherwise. I also have a compulsive need to appear well-adjusted and healthy, which I am slowly but surely shaking off in therapy (next step- blue hair!).
I can certainly see why you would relate to him. You sound very much like him! Good for you for recognizing and getting help, though. I have suffered with depression for most of my life (I'm WAY older than you, btw!) and I can understand what you have gone through.
I do believe House is a tragic character, but it frustrated me, for example, that he couldn't just tell Wilson, Yes, yes I am in therapy, now FUCK OFF. I understand why he didn't, but I really wish he would.
I wish he would, too! Just once I'd like to see him just tell him off and walk away. Sadly, he never will because he needs Wilson. He carries guilt because of Amber, and I really think House believes he owes Wilson more than he can ever give. It's sad to see what abuse the man will take from both Wilson and Cuddy. It's sadder to think that he believes he deserves it.
too long... continued below
(no subject)
On the one hand, I do think Wilson is dangerous in that he doesn't know when House is in a bad place, where pushing could have serious negative results. On the other hand, House knows exactly HOW to push when he wants to hurt Wilson. I'm not sure that he ever would, but if he wanted to House is entirely capable of hurting Wilson deeply at a bad moment. I think we see this side of House most when he's being mean to Cuddy, which is another reason I can't get behind the pairing.
In terms of depression, I got lucky enough to make two incredibly friends who helped me SO much. I met them when I was 14, and this guy was 17, and he could be doing anything at all, and if I showed up and needed to talk, he would drop anything. The other friend had swallowed a bottle of aspirin a year before, and she was the one who helped me ask my parents for therapy. There were a few other guys who were kind-of big brothers to me, and they all took such good care of me. Not related to H/W at all, so moving on...
I've been thinking about what you can owe someone without some sort of implied consent on you part. The only thing I can think of is money. What House thinks he owes Wilson is crap, because he didn't really agree to be in a place to owe them. Does that make sense? And for Wilson, I don't think he WANTS House to owe him, exactly, but I do think Wilson is so tired and run-down that he doesn't have it in him to fix his relationship with House, and having House feel he owes Wilson makes Wilson's life easier. Did that make sense?
(no subject)
What bugs me more than anything is that there could be a discussion following (say, for example, a spoiler) where not only is Cuddy not in it, but there is nothing to even suggest that she even exists and the Huddy shippers will inevitably jump in with "OMG Huddy sex!!". There's nothing more intolerable for me than when a nice, intelligent discussion is totally ruined by a comment that is completely irrelevant and uncalled for. The other thing is that the Huddy shippers are the first to call everyone else bitter. (I'm not saying other shippers are not guilty, but the Huddy shippers are certainly the loudest and most outspoken, IMHO.)
On the one hand, I do think Wilson is dangerous in that he doesn't know when House is in a bad place, where pushing could have serious negative results. On the other hand, House knows exactly HOW to push when he wants to hurt Wilson. I'm not sure that he ever would, but if he wanted to House is entirely capable of hurting Wilson deeply at a bad moment. I think we see this side of House most when he's being mean to Cuddy, which is another reason I can't get behind the pairing.
I absolutely agree. There was never a doubt that House was capable of hurting people. I just watched "Finding Judas" last night and I think it is a good example of how House can intentionally hurt someone if he wants to. House can be hurtful to anyone at anytime. It's one of his character' main traits and it's perfectly balanced by the amount of good he does by saving patients when no one else can.
I've been thinking about what you can owe someone without some sort of implied consent on you part. The only thing I can think of is money. What House thinks he owes Wilson is crap, because he didn't really agree to be in a place to owe them. Does that make sense?
I'm not too sure I understand what you mean here. Remove Wilson from the equation and put in the scenario from "Words and Deeds" where Cuddy lied on the witness stand to keep House from going to jail. How do you see this as an example of what you are trying to say? I'm guessing that in this example what you would be saying is that House doesn't owe Cuddy a thing because he never asked her to perjure herself on his behalf. She holds it over his head for a long time afterwards, but it was her choice to do what she did and she shouldn't use it against House. Is this what you are saying?
And for Wilson, I don't think he WANTS House to owe him, exactly, but I do think Wilson is so tired and run-down that he doesn't have it in him to fix his relationship with House, and having House feel he owes Wilson makes Wilson's life easier. Did that make sense?
This makes sense, yes.
In terms of depression, I got lucky enough to make two incredibly friends who helped me SO much.
Friends can be lifesavers, can't they?